On being a good Listener

00:00:00:04 – 00:00:03:47
David Martin
This is the good government show.

00:00:03:52 – 00:00:12:20
Christian Leinbach
I don’t know about you. It’s easier for me to just let go and let my temper fly.

00:00:12:25 – 00:00:21:44
Christian Leinbach
You’d be surprised how many constituents contact elected officials and never hear back from them.

00:00:21:49 – 00:00:28:24
Christian Leinbach
Most things that are worthwhile take time.

00:00:28:29 – 00:00:40:00
Christian Leinbach
Leadership can make a difference, and cooperation can save money and actually, in time, save lives.

00:00:40:04 – 00:00:53:01
Christian Leinbach
Make decisions not based on R.D. or independent, but make decisions based on what’s in the best interest of the County of Berks.

00:00:53:06 – 00:01:02:27
Christian Leinbach
I can be courageous and kind. At the same time, I can be strong and humble.

00:01:02:32 – 00:01:19:12
David Martin
Usually when elected officials get in front of a microphone, it’s to talk about whatever the current problem of the day is. On this episode, we really dig down and talk about how to be an effective government leader. Welcome to the Good Government show. I’m Dave Martin. First, help us share the message of good government by liking us and sharing us on your favorite social media.

00:01:19:14 – 00:01:34:27
David Martin
Review us and give everybody a copy of our show. We all need to talk about good government. Over the years, I’ve really gotten to know my friend Berks County Commissioner Christian Linebacker. Sometimes when the mix aren’t on, we get into a little political debate and we don’t always agree. But on this show, we do agree about one thing.

00:01:34:30 – 00:01:54:00
David Martin
As long as we’re talking, we have a chance to work together. Since I’ve become familiar with a lot of the issues in Berks County and central Pennsylvania, I got to check in on some good government projects. So it’s great to be able to track progress, especially when a good government project continues, as you’ll hear. Coming up, Christian linebacker and his thoughts about making sure everyone is heard.

00:01:54:00 – 00:01:59:37
David Martin
And we talk about how to govern in a time when not everyone is thinking about good government for all of us.

00:01:59:38 – 00:02:03:35
Christian Leinbach
That’s next.

00:02:03:40 – 00:02:30:22
David Martin
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00:02:30:24 – 00:02:54:49
David Martin
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00:02:54:51 – 00:03:03:51
David Martin
Let Hello Nation lift you up and lead the conversation. Visit Hello Nation to learn more.

00:03:03:56 – 00:03:21:57
David Martin
Once you wrap up this episode of The Good Government Show, give a listen to our friends over at Good News for lefties. This daily podcast highlights news stories that show there’s more good news out there. Other people in government are really trying to do the right thing. That’s good news for lefties. Listen where you’re listening now.

00:03:22:02 – 00:03:31:23
David Martin
Welcome back to The Good Government Show once again, Christian Linebacker, the county commissioner for Berks County, Pennsylvania, fourth or fifth appearance. Here are the good governor of jail. I’m not keeping.

00:03:31:35 – 00:03:35:23
Christian Leinbach
I’m not keeping track either. But it’s a it’s a good appearance every time.

00:03:35:23 – 00:03:44:05
David Martin
Here’s what I do know. You are our most welcome guest. And our I think we’ve had you on more than any other guest. So welcome back. It’s always a pleasure to talk to you.

00:03:44:08 – 00:03:45:15
Christian Leinbach
Thank you. Good to be back.

00:03:45:17 – 00:04:04:06
David Martin
And one of the things I like talking about with you when we catch up is we get to explore more about what’s going on in government because we’ve we’ve sort of talked about the projects that we’ve been doing for for years. But I think right now, you know, we’re recording this here at the National Association of Counties in Washington, D.C. it’s the end of February.

00:04:04:14 – 00:04:20:29
David Martin
Not an easy time to be in government, is it? How do you keep the faith and more importantly, how do you let the citizens know of of Berks County and of Pennsylvania and of the United States of America, that governments do a good job, because that’s not the message that’s getting out there. Yeah.

00:04:20:39 – 00:04:24:03
Christian Leinbach
And there’s a couple of answers to that. I, I think I have to.

00:04:24:05 – 00:04:24:53
David Martin
Admit, you do.

00:04:24:56 – 00:05:00:17
Christian Leinbach
I have to admit that when I first got in office and someone would, you know, attack me, I had a tendency to just jump right back. And I learned over time that that’s not the way to handle anyone. Doesn’t matter whether they’re right or wrong or indifferent. And I have I really work at trying to stay calm, listen to what people have to say, even if I think it’s crazy listening and then determining what’s the appropriate way to respond.

00:05:00:17 – 00:05:43:29
Christian Leinbach
And sometimes you just simply need to say, look, we are on really opposite sides of this issue. I respect your right to believe what you believe. I’m not going to debate you. Okay? And because what I’ve learned, sometimes it’s easy to get into the focus on winning the argument and forgetting that as an elected official or job is to present a vision of good government, for in my case, the county of Berks, and do everything I can to follow through working with other partners, whether they’re other counties, whether they’re staff within the organization.

00:05:43:29 – 00:05:57:09
Christian Leinbach
And be quite frank, if you get the reputation of somebody that takes on every argument, no matter how stupid it is, other people will say, I want to stay away. Yeah. The other thing I do.

00:05:57:12 – 00:06:02:21
David Martin
I literally just go ahead. What you’re saying really is, is that your older, grayer Budweiser.

00:06:02:31 – 00:06:09:57
Christian Leinbach
I’m hopefully I’m wiser, I am older, I am grayer. Yes, I know that’s part of our lives, both of us.

00:06:09:57 – 00:06:14:01
David Martin
I hope both of us are. Thanks for bringing. We learned from experience.

00:06:14:06 – 00:06:38:21
Christian Leinbach
Thank you. You learn from experience. I’m not one of those people that your mother says. Don’t touch the stove. It’s hot. Yeah, I touch the stove, I burn my hand. And I said, I’m never going to do that again. And so I’ve learned a lot the hard way. The other thing I do, and this isn’t for everyone, but in my Christian faith, every single morning, I pray for wisdom through the day.

00:06:38:21 – 00:06:41:19
Christian Leinbach
I specifically pray, help me be calm.

00:06:41:21 – 00:06:44:18
David Martin
Are there are times in the middle of the day when you pray for. There are.

00:06:44:23 – 00:07:04:15
Christian Leinbach
There are to be because it’s hard. Yeah, and you’re right. I would say for me, since about when President Obama hit his first midterms. Yeah. And he took the opposite view of Bill Clinton when he had his midterms. Both of them both of them got crushed in their midterms. Sure. Bill Clinton.

00:07:04:17 – 00:07:05:05
David Martin
Which is typical.

00:07:05:05 – 00:07:25:04
Christian Leinbach
It is very typical historically. Yeah. Bill Clinton said, okay, got the message I’m going to work with. If you remember, it was Newt Gingrich contract with America. And as I look back at the Clinton era, yeah, from 92 all the way to 2000, it really wasn’t that bad.

00:07:25:06 – 00:07:25:59
David Martin
No, it was instead.

00:07:26:11 – 00:07:42:58
Christian Leinbach
Of all of the Monica Lewinsky. And and here’s the reason government worked. You had Clinton administration working with Democrat, working with the Republicans and communicating. When President Obama hit his first midterms, he got crushed.

00:07:43:01 – 00:07:43:13
David Martin
Yep.

00:07:43:15 – 00:08:11:42
Christian Leinbach
And he did the opposite. He dug in. And you saw the rise of the Tea Party. I’m not excusing the far right or the far left, but since then, it seems consistently the digging in and the refusal to talk to each other, becoming less and less civil has just continued and grow. It’s easy to blame it on individuals, but I think, let’s be honest, it’s easy.

00:08:11:47 – 00:08:20:05
Christian Leinbach
I don’t know about you. It’s easier for me to just let go and let my temper fly. It takes a lot more control to say.

00:08:20:20 – 00:08:23:34
David Martin
Christian shut out this part, right?

00:08:23:36 – 00:08:25:00
Christian Leinbach
It does, but.

00:08:25:03 – 00:08:30:48
David Martin
Well, how do you you know, you’re a you’re a politician whether you like it or not. You’ve been a county commissioner for.

00:08:30:53 – 00:08:31:10
Christian Leinbach
In my.

00:08:31:12 – 00:08:55:14
David Martin
1919 year as county commissioner. You’re hearing all this and you’re seeing all this, and we’ve had this argument off, off Mike and on Mike many times over the years. You know, there’s extremes. You know, we disagree. But there are extremes on both sides. You’re you’re trying to be more of a centrist in your role as county commission. How do you get that message out and how do you reinforce that message, and how do you get people to listen to that message?

00:08:55:15 – 00:09:20:33
Christian Leinbach
So a couple of things. One, I’m very careful what I post on social media and how I say or write whatever I’m posting. I don’t tackle every single issue that’s out there to when I’m leading a meeting, and I’ve had people comment to me about this. I work to be very fair, whether I agree or disagree. We just had a town hall that was challenging.

00:09:20:38 – 00:09:44:20
Christian Leinbach
Large town hall had to do with Ice, purchasing a warehouse in northern Berks County, blindsiding us at the county level. A number of the people wanted me to just come out and say that I’m going to do everything I can to stop it, and my answer was no. I’m doing everything I can to get answers on every aspect of that, but I didn’t them in a fight.

00:09:44:22 – 00:10:13:27
Christian Leinbach
A lot of people take the bait and they start a verbal battle back and forth. And not only do you not win, I don’t think a leader builds credibility by. Picking the next fighting with constituents. Here’s another thing I do my best to respond to everybody who asks for a response. People contact me on LinkedIn. They contact me on Facebook Messenger, they call me, call in on the phone, email.

00:10:13:27 – 00:10:29:03
Christian Leinbach
And in the last couple of weeks, that’s meant me staying very late several nights. And I know some others that have said to me, just, you’re never going to win. Some of these people don’t waste your time, but I can’t tell you.

00:10:29:07 – 00:10:31:10
David Martin
I talked to you win a few over from time to time.

00:10:31:17 – 00:10:56:25
Christian Leinbach
Not necessarily. But here’s what I find. I called the lady that the two of us are not going to agree at all. Yes, but I called her back, let her say her piece and let her know what my concerns were, and we left it with Commissioner Lembeck. I really appreciate that you called me back. You’d be surprised how many constituents contact elected officials and never hear back from them, right?

00:10:56:27 – 00:11:15:57
Christian Leinbach
I hear that all the time. And so being willing to talk to people, even people that, you know, you’re going to disagree with and, you know, it’s highly unlikely you’re going to sway them and maybe you’re not even trying to sway them. You’re listening to what they have to say. And answering the questions is honestly as you can.

00:11:16:00 – 00:11:17:21
Christian Leinbach
I think that’s important.

00:11:17:24 – 00:11:26:49
David Martin
And I think that’s a lesson for other county officials or other government officials, is you may not agree, but at least when they walk away they go, well, linebacker. Not such a bad guy after all. Yeah.

00:11:26:52 – 00:11:51:46
Christian Leinbach
Well my colleague I agree, my colleague, Commissioner Dante Santoni, Democrat. When I took office, Commissioner Santoni was in the state House of Representatives. Democrat. We got to know each other. We went through a heavy duty campaign in 2023. And so when he came into office, I had one of the first I forget what the issue was. He walked over to me.

00:11:51:48 – 00:12:01:57
Christian Leinbach
He said, you know, I’m on the opposite side of you on this issue. And I said, okay, here’s my advice. Be as passion as that. You as you want to be. Let’s not make it personal.

00:12:01:59 – 00:12:03:07
David Martin
Right? Is that hard?

00:12:03:09 – 00:12:29:03
Christian Leinbach
For me, it’s become a norm. But I will tell you, because times you’ve got your older, wiser. But what I still struggle with is if somebody blindsides you, you’re not expecting them to come after you on something. And it’s normally it’s an in person. I got to really work at that because I can feel the heat rising and saying, well, I want to just verbally smack this person.

00:12:29:07 – 00:12:31:00
David Martin
There’s a little voice in the back of your head say.

00:12:31:05 – 00:12:38:00
Christian Leinbach
Don’t do it. Don’t do it. Chris should stop. Well, there’s another voice says, hit him, hit him. The other one says, don’t do it. Don’t know.

00:12:38:12 – 00:12:55:01
David Martin
So let’s just talk about some of the ways that you’ve made Berks County better. This is one of my favorite stories. I cite this all the time is the R-3 program. The recidivism program that’s drop recidivism down from the national average of 65% to like, 5%. How’s the program going? Just going to be a quick update.

00:12:55:03 – 00:13:21:02
Christian Leinbach
Continuing to go very, very well. We are putting, I think, around 220 to $250,000 in it. But the recidivism rate of people who graduate from that program roughly every 9 to 10 weeks is below 10%. That’s a huge improvement over the national average. The national average, I believe, is up over 60%.

00:13:21:11 – 00:13:25:30
David Martin
So I think I check with your staff on this, and I think you’ve got it up to like 5% towns. Like.

00:13:25:41 – 00:13:51:38
Christian Leinbach
I think you’re probably right. I just I tried to be conservative. I know it’s the single digits, Commissioner. Single digits. I’ll tell you another one. Just this week, Berks was one of the first counties prior to my time as a commissioner in 2008 to start treatment courts, and I believe the first was DUI court and drug court, and a treatment court provides alternatives to jail for people that meet certain requirements.

00:13:51:43 – 00:14:14:18
Christian Leinbach
It does not involve violent crimes, but these have been so successful. And over the years we’ve added mental health court and veterans court. Just this past week, the PC, which is the unit in our Commonwealth of Pennsylvania that oversees our courts, certified the treatment courts in Berks County.

00:14:14:20 – 00:14:14:35
David Martin
Oh.

00:14:14:37 – 00:14:41:21
Christian Leinbach
That’s been and so I had Judge Elaine Geist Hauser come in with some folks from her staff, folks from probation, just this past Thursday to talk about why it’s important, why it works. And she shared their number on treatment courts is 7% recidivism rate. Those are people. And they’re and they’re checking three years later, people that come through this court.

00:14:41:26 – 00:15:04:39
Christian Leinbach
And they said it’s a very tough system. There are some people that say, wow, I think it would have been easier to go to jail than to go through this treatment court program. So it’s a real thing. Yeah, but it works. And David, isn’t that what it’s all about? So you’re changing just like our three, the treatment courts are changing the lives of people and their families around them fundamentally.

00:15:04:41 – 00:15:07:41
Christian Leinbach
And guess what? It’s saving taxpayer money.

00:15:07:43 – 00:15:12:43
David Martin
Well, that’s I was going to mention that I mean, both sides. No small bonus here. You’re saving money.

00:15:12:46 – 00:15:42:27
Christian Leinbach
Especially when they’re not going to jail. Right. And then you have pretty much 93% not coming back into the criminal justice system. So those are things that I’m proud of being a part of. But I can’t emphasize enough in this case without folks in our probation office and folks in our courts and judges like Judge Johnson, who’s now our president, judge, first female president, judge in Berks and Judge Saucer.

00:15:42:32 – 00:15:44:48
Christian Leinbach
Without people like them, that wouldn’t have happened.

00:15:44:59 – 00:15:46:51
David Martin
The two women who are running the R-3 still, they’re.

00:15:46:51 – 00:16:08:23
Christian Leinbach
Both of them. The co-directors, Peggy and Nicki Schnabel. Yeah. They’re amazing. Yes they are. I think week I believe it’s a week from this Monday. They’re doing another one of their career fairs, and that’s for people coming out of our treatment courts coming out of jail, probably we’ll have 40 different businesses there and they help them write a resume.

00:16:08:28 – 00:16:30:14
Christian Leinbach
They on the spot, help them do Moca interviews so that when they go to actually meet the businesses and fill out an application and do the interviews, they’ve had help from professionals. Our solicitor, our county solicitor volunteers their time to help almost every year, while twice a year they do that.

00:16:30:14 – 00:16:32:22
David Martin
And are you still a graduation speaker? What do you can be?

00:16:32:24 – 00:16:35:17
Christian Leinbach
I still am a graduation speaker at our three. You bet.

00:16:35:17 – 00:16:44:56
David Martin
So when we met, you told me about the trains that you were going to bring to Berks County. How long before I can. I can take the train from Brooklyn and Berks. How are we doing?

00:16:44:57 – 00:17:13:31
Christian Leinbach
Well, there’s two, two things we’re doing very, very well. I was actually this morning in a presentation with Amtrak and spoke afterwards to the lady from Amtrak. We were very excited. We believe that his early as 2029, 2030, the line could be running between Redding and Philadelphia. Okay. The key for Moynihan Station in downtown Manhattan is the expansion of the Hudson River tunnel.

00:17:13:33 – 00:17:37:54
Christian Leinbach
Right. So the Hudson River tunnel was fully. That’s right. It was fully funded. It was started. The Trump administration has delayed it. I asked specifically about that this morning. The lady I spoke to believes that it is going to move forward. It’s not a question of if it will be finished. It’s a question of the time. Originally it was set for 2035 completion.

00:17:38:08 – 00:17:46:46
Christian Leinbach
I would say that date is in jeopardy, but right now Amtrak is very positive about the efforts.

00:17:46:46 – 00:17:49:10
David Martin
Of, with or without someone’s name on the tunnel or the.

00:17:49:15 – 00:18:14:56
Christian Leinbach
Exactly so Berks, Chester, Montgomery County, we are still all in on this. And incidentally, last spring all three of us had to vote to the authority for 47 more years. We set that in place specifically to give an opportunity after three years to say, is this still a good idea? And unanimously said yes.

00:18:14:56 – 00:18:34:36
David Martin
How do you keep focus on a project like this? This is going on for years and the completion date is still years away. And the other important question, you know, in that mix is how do you justify to the citizens spending money and time on a project that’s years in the planning and years before completion?

00:18:34:41 – 00:18:44:21
Christian Leinbach
First of all, I’ll say most things that are worthwhile take time. Another lesson that I’ve learned in life, and they normally take you’re.

00:18:44:21 – 00:18:44:40
David Martin
Going to be.

00:18:44:40 – 00:18:45:06
Christian Leinbach
So smart.

00:18:45:09 – 00:18:46:09
David Martin
In the couple more years.

00:18:46:23 – 00:19:18:12
Christian Leinbach
About the time I die, okay? It takes people championing an effort and staying with it. Sometimes it’s easy for human beings to see the next shiny thing, and then let that go and go to the next shiny thing. Two examples of success our Redding Regional Airport. And I’ll come back to this about seven years ago, talking to some key aviation people said to me, the county needs to take a direct role on this, and I was the only one that believed that and leadership at the time.

00:19:18:12 – 00:19:51:19
Christian Leinbach
And I worked and worked and worked. And finally, in 2022, all three commissioners agreed. The authority agreed. And now we’re entering our third year of direct county involvement. And we for the first time have increased aviation business. Both use but actual aviation tenants at the airport. We’re in the black and we just brought in last year Netjets and Netjets, I think will probably become our largest customer.

00:19:51:19 – 00:19:53:10
Christian Leinbach
That took almost 70 years.

00:19:53:12 – 00:19:54:07
David Martin
Private jet service.

00:19:54:09 – 00:20:22:58
Christian Leinbach
Yeah. Fractional ownership jet service. That took almost seven years. David. Yeah. Tomorrow I will be chairing the midsize county caucus. That’s another thing I brought up here at Naco back in 2019 for certain, saying, you know, Berks County is too small to be part of Nico’s large urban county caucus. You need 500,000 people or more. And we’re too large to be part of the Rural Action Caucus.

00:20:23:01 – 00:20:50:42
Christian Leinbach
There’s no place for us here. And I found out, well, there’s actually a lot of counties like that. And so we started talking. And last year, the board of directors officially formed the Midsize County Caucus. Here at con is the first formal meeting of the midsize county caucus. It takes time for things that are worthwhile. And I see the Schuylkill River passenger rail exactly in the same way.

00:20:50:42 – 00:20:52:47
Christian Leinbach
And I’m I’m in for the long haul.

00:20:52:47 – 00:20:54:08
David Martin
What else you got your back pocket?

00:20:54:08 – 00:21:33:04
Christian Leinbach
Well, right now I’m excited working with Lehigh County, Lackawanna County, Dauphin County, and the center of the state and Berks to develop a jointly owned and operated youth detention center. And we’re not talking about youth shoplifting. These are violent criminals, many of them tied directly to gangs. And we don’t have good places to put them today. All of us, three of us, Lehigh, Dauphin and Berks have been involved with something called Abraxas in southern Berks County, a privately run youth detention center.

00:21:33:16 – 00:22:01:47
Christian Leinbach
That’s a disaster. We used to have 12 beds each. I think we’re down to three beds each. But that’s not the disaster. They’ve had riots, breakouts, escapes. They were just recently decertified by the Commonwealth of Pennsylvania. That’s not acceptable. And we’re not interested in just housing violent youth. We want to do everything we can. These are minors. These are young people potentially with their life ahead of them.

00:22:01:50 – 00:22:02:26
Christian Leinbach
We are going.

00:22:02:26 – 00:22:08:30
David Martin
To do what we talked about earlier. Yeah. If you can fix it. Everybody say you save a life and you save money. You save money.

00:22:08:35 – 00:22:32:22
Christian Leinbach
So that’s what our objective is. We’re in the process right now of each county signing on to a fiscal agreement. I believe Dauphin County is already signed on. Lehigh I believe, is ready. Lackawanna. And now we’ve been approached by Delaware County, okay. Delaware County, Pennsylvania is very interested in this. And we’re we’ll see if we are able to bring them in.

00:22:32:22 – 00:22:34:05
David Martin
But again, regional cooperation.

00:22:34:19 – 00:22:57:13
Christian Leinbach
Regional cooperation. That’s how Schuylkill River passenger rail was initiated. We did that years ago with public transportation in Lancaster and Berks merge the two I really believe that’s the future of local governance, especially at the county level, is getting together and saving money with regional solutions.

00:22:57:15 – 00:23:04:05
David Martin
Well, it sounds like a good solution and we’re. Doing it a reading and it sounds like good government. Even better. It’s good governance.

00:23:04:15 – 00:23:33:54
Christian Leinbach
In central Pennsylvania, you have two counties that are right next to each other, Union and Snyder County. They decided they both didn’t need a jail, okay. They got rid of two jails merging into one and immediately saved significant dollars. That’s smart. That’s smart governance. I know two of the commissioners there that were big part of it, Joe Cantz, who is now president of our state association from Snyder County, and Preston Boo, longtime commissioner from Union County.

00:23:34:03 – 00:23:42:20
Christian Leinbach
Leadership can make a difference and cooperation can save money and actually, in times, save lives.

00:23:42:22 – 00:23:44:00
David Martin
All right. Are you ready for the questions?

00:23:44:03 – 00:23:47:51
Christian Leinbach
Go for it.

00:23:47:55 – 00:24:11:44
David Martin
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00:24:11:44 – 00:24:23:24
David Martin
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00:24:23:29 – 00:24:52:23
David Martin
After you get done with this episode. Hear more good government stories with our friends at How to Really Run a City for memories, Kasim Reed of Atlanta and Michael Nutter of Philadelphia, and their co-host, journalist and author Larry Platt talk with guests and other mayors about how to really get stuff done in cities around the nation. Check them out where you’re listening now or through their nonprofit news site, The Citizen.

00:24:52:28 – 00:25:02:32
David Martin
We’ve asked these questions before. I’m going to give you a little spin, but we’re going to start with the same question. What’s good government 19 years as county commissioner? What’s good government in Berks County? What’s good government of America?

00:25:02:34 – 00:25:05:44
Christian Leinbach
Two different things I think good government.

00:25:05:48 – 00:25:07:22
David Martin
Government should be the same everywhere.

00:25:07:24 – 00:25:44:53
Christian Leinbach
Good government in Berks County is a county leadership that listens, but also takes the time to research, think for ourselves, bring good people on our team, keep them on our team, and then make decisions not based on R.D. or independent, but make decisions based on what’s in the best interest of the County of Berks. And I will add, it means allowing your colleagues to disagree with you and to say you and I’ve talked about this, we can passionately disagree.

00:25:44:53 – 00:26:09:16
Christian Leinbach
There’s nothing wrong with passion, right? Let’s not make it personal and let’s not. I can be courageous and kind at the same time. I can be strong and humble, and I think that’s what good governance needs to be. And unfortunately, it’s in really short supply at multiple levels of government.

00:26:09:23 – 00:26:10:44
David Martin
What are you doing about that?

00:26:10:49 – 00:26:14:54
Christian Leinbach
What I control is me and the things that are around.

00:26:14:56 – 00:26:16:44
David Martin
Take a breath. I don’t get excited.

00:26:16:46 – 00:26:35:45
Christian Leinbach
That’s right. And hopefully some people will learn that that’s how you get things done. That’s how you make a difference. And I believe it’s one of the reasons I’m here in my 19th year. People don’t generally like people that are a bull in a China shop.

00:26:35:48 – 00:26:41:32
David Martin
Sure. What would you like people in reading and people in Allentown to do to help government work better?

00:26:41:33 – 00:27:06:32
Christian Leinbach
I think one of the things that they can do is understand that when they read a story in the news here, it on the good government show wherever it might be, and so that you can only get so much information and try not to make a definitive decision on whether you support or oppose something based on what you read or heard on the news.

00:27:06:36 – 00:27:33:30
Christian Leinbach
Check it out. I love people who call me or text me and say, I heard you say this. I heard that you’re supporting this. I don’t understand why you would support this. Here are my questions. I love that because you’ve got a person that may not agree with me, maybe actually does, doesn’t know it, but they take the time to ask and do their own research.

00:27:33:32 – 00:28:06:26
Christian Leinbach
Today, more than any time in my life, people have become lazy and they tend to follow people. Whether they’re following a president blindly, they’re following a priest, following a pastor, following a school teacher. The good people, the smart people dig in and find out what it is that’s going on. Determine what they believe, why they believe it, and then are able to defend what they believe, but at the same time, continue to listen.

00:28:06:30 – 00:28:20:21
Christian Leinbach
Because I’m often shocked. I listen and say, you know what? I didn’t know that even though I’m the person that’s supposed to know everything. Clue I don’t know everything. Not close. But that.

00:28:20:21 – 00:28:22:56
David Martin
That I could have. Good government called me.

00:28:23:01 – 00:28:45:28
Christian Leinbach
Not not running around and saying everyone else is an idiot and I know everything, right? And we all know people that do that. That is damaging, that’s damaging to government, that’s damaging to how people view government. And in the end, I think it’s damaging, damaging to whatever area of government a person overseas.

00:28:45:28 – 00:28:46:52
David Martin
How do you stay inspired?

00:28:46:52 – 00:29:13:57
Christian Leinbach
So couple of things. My faith is a big part of my inspiration. I believe I’m called to be a good example. The famous line from Ronald Reagan, which is actually from Matthew chapter five, A city on a hill and the idea of a city on a hill, a bright city on a hill is people see it and say, wow, that’s that’s something that I’m proud of or I want to attain to.

00:29:14:00 – 00:29:32:16
Christian Leinbach
That’s one. But I think the other way that we need to learn. I have to continue to work on is that we don’t have to respond to everything that’s thrown out there. And that’s, that’s that’s hard for me. Even now.

00:29:32:18 – 00:29:33:18
David Martin
That’s the keyboard.

00:29:33:23 – 00:29:44:22
Christian Leinbach
I feel like I’ve got this issues come up that issues come up. I remember when I first took office, I think you met Mary Muir. She was with me for 14 years. She was.

00:29:44:36 – 00:29:44:46
David Martin
My.

00:29:44:46 – 00:30:00:59
Christian Leinbach
Executive assistant. Great ladies retired now. Yes. Early on she said to me two things, Christian, you can’t meet with everybody and you can’t solve and take on every battle. Good. And I said, you.

00:30:00:59 – 00:30:03:26
David Martin
Know, have someone smarter than you. You’re right. Office.

00:30:03:28 – 00:30:30:34
Christian Leinbach
You’re right. And so you have to pick what it is that you’re going to go after. One of the things that I do and my colleagues do now, and I didn’t do until maybe six years ago. Every year we present our goals for that year publicly. We did that two weeks ago in the county, and I rate on a grade scale how I think I did on my goals for the prior year.

00:30:30:34 – 00:30:36:31
Christian Leinbach
And then I put it up on my website. We put it up on PowerPoint on on the county website.

00:30:36:38 – 00:30:37:40
David Martin
How’d you do last year?

00:30:37:40 – 00:30:39:45
Christian Leinbach
I think overall pretty well, but there was a couple.

00:30:39:48 – 00:30:40:38
David Martin
Are you a tough grader?

00:30:40:40 – 00:31:03:03
Christian Leinbach
I’m a tough grader. So okay. On transportation a B on the jail, and B because there was some projects that I wanted to see go forward that didn’t. They’re delayed on the jail. I gave myself a C because I, at the beginning of the year, was saying, I think we need to restart the project to build a new jail.

00:31:03:13 – 00:31:29:11
Christian Leinbach
And my leadership team actually came to me shortly after that and said, Christian, this is unaffordable for now, in the foreseeable future. I agreed with them, but that was a goal. So you can’t be an A on that. But some of the A’s were our election security and integrity. Our election staff ran two bulletproof elections in the primary and the general thrilled with it.

00:31:29:11 – 00:31:58:40
Christian Leinbach
The airport is an A school of river passenger rail. I believe I put a B+ because the process with federal, the Federal Rail Administration has really slowed down. And it’s primarily because what they’re doing right now with this program, like 69 across the country, they never did before. It all came about through the Biden bipartisan infrastructure bill that put money on the table and directed Fra, this is what you’re going to do.

00:31:58:40 – 00:32:08:47
Christian Leinbach
So it’s their first time to the dance. And I get that. But it’s frustrating that we didn’t get through step one in last year. So yeah.

00:32:08:52 – 00:32:12:37
David Martin
So no a what do you know now about government you didn’t know 19 years ago?

00:32:12:40 – 00:32:24:08
Christian Leinbach
I knew nothing about mental health. Well, no, not now. There’s where you take a clip out of context. Yes. Commissioner linebacker said he knows nothing.

00:32:24:10 – 00:32:25:53
David Martin
About that period.

00:32:25:58 – 00:32:52:44
Christian Leinbach
But mental health. I had no idea how big of an issue it was. Children, youth. I just didn’t know that. And then I watched it just expand in our jails and us having to deal with that. Children and youth. I didn’t know anything about children and youth coming in. I thought, you know, county government was dealing with the budget, being fiscally responsible.

00:32:52:44 – 00:33:22:50
Christian Leinbach
But even there, I shared a couple of weeks ago, I said, if I’m fully honest, when I said fiscal responsibility is job number one, it was more political rhetoric than because I understood how important that was to county government. I now understand that our bond rating that we’ve had since 19 is critical. So there are things that I just flat out didn’t know.

00:33:22:50 – 00:33:47:51
Christian Leinbach
I never thought I’d be involved in restoration of railroad. I never thought I’d be involved in the airport, the railroad, in my first term in office study came out, and it never went beyond the study. It was the infamous tolling of route 422. It was DOA, and I thought, I won’t see that again in my lifetime. I was wrong.

00:33:48:03 – 00:34:04:50
Christian Leinbach
So part of it is being aware of what’s going on and asking the question, where’s the greatest opportunity for my community to succeed? And then putting my energy behind those things? If everything’s a priority, nothing’s a priority.

00:34:04:52 – 00:34:09:33
David Martin
What’s the one thing you’d like listeners to know about government that they don’t know? The one thing.

00:34:09:47 – 00:34:50:47
Christian Leinbach
Probably the biggest thing is they probably for full time elected officials and at least the county government. I don’t think they have any idea how complex county government actually is. And I say larger county government it more complex. But I have colleagues in rural counties in Pennsylvania who are trying to deal with ambulance service because it takes 45 minutes to get an ambulance to rural community or a five county area in Pennsylvania where there’s not only not a single hospital, no birthing center.

00:34:50:47 – 00:35:24:42
Christian Leinbach
So that’s complex. Yeah, that’s a health issue. I don’t think the average person realizes what it is a county commissioner is dealing with, and that’s helped me to not waste a lot of time taking on governors, presidents, congressional leaders. I try to stay focused on the issue that I need to address for my community and try to stay out of attacking this person or that person, because I don’t like a particular issue or the way they said something.

00:35:24:45 – 00:35:28:13
David Martin
What’s your favorite place in reading, Berks County, Pennsylvania? Well.

00:35:28:18 – 00:35:49:24
Christian Leinbach
My favorite place in Berks County is Hawk Mountain Sanctuary. Okay. It’s the oldest raptor sanctuary in the world. Almost every other raptor sanctuary. And I visited several. You mentioned Hawk Mountain. They know all about it. My favorite place in Redding is the peanut bar restaurant. The lifer family.

00:35:49:27 – 00:35:50:07
David Martin
The peanut bar.

00:35:50:10 – 00:36:07:28
Christian Leinbach
The peanut bar. Last year was their hundredth anniversary for restaurant. Wow, that’s a big deal. Subpoena bar, because everybody gets served peanuts. So if you have a peanut allergy, you don’t want to go to the peanut bar, though it should be pretty obvious. Yes, but you crack your the peanut and you throw the shells on the floor.

00:36:07:30 – 00:36:07:57
David Martin
Good.

00:36:08:04 – 00:36:34:31
Christian Leinbach
But Michael lifer, very good friend of mine. He’s there every every single time. Reading public museum for a county our size. The Reddick Public Museum is a world class museum. We’ve had the Appalachian Trail in northern Berks County that goes up into Lehigh County. So your WABE listeners, if they go up 309, the Appalachian Trail crosses right over 309.

00:36:34:37 – 00:36:36:05
Christian Leinbach
I’ve hiked that part of it.

00:36:36:07 – 00:36:36:45
David Martin
All right, all.

00:36:36:48 – 00:36:39:14
Christian Leinbach
Right, all right. So there’s a lot to love in Berks County.

00:36:39:16 – 00:36:46:23
David Martin
Good. This is the good government show. We like to end on good government. Tell me about a good government project that you’re trying to get off the ground that you’re excited about.

00:36:46:23 – 00:37:11:55
Christian Leinbach
You can get disagreement on this, but it’s again, one of my initiatives is the proper utilization of generative AI. All right. I am a tech person at heart. There are a lot of risks with AI, but you start as you do with any technology. I believe technology, whether it was the telephone, the TV, the technologies agnostic, it’s how you use it.

00:37:11:55 – 00:37:39:08
Christian Leinbach
And so you start by overlaying policy with ethics on how you’re going to use it. We have already begun the process. I’m one of the pilots literally using Microsoft Copilot. So that’s an initiative that really just began. I think it can help the public and here’s why the public should care. Getting them quicker access to the information they need and want in a particular department and county government.

00:37:39:08 – 00:38:05:09
Christian Leinbach
We’re working to do that. We’re looking at several different solutions and making us internally more efficient, more accurate communications, documentation, etc.. The other thing I’m doing major initiative. In the next 5 to 10 years, we will turn over about 60% of the leadership in our county just by looking at age. All you need to look at and I will be one of those.

00:38:05:11 – 00:38:34:33
Christian Leinbach
Yes. And I come to believe how important the people are on our team at every level. Bottom to top. I don’t even like the bottom to top. It kind of implies if you’re at the bottom, you’re less important. Everyone is important every level and really focusing on making sure we have the right people in the right positions and that we are supporting people with appropriate pay, attractive benefits and good training tools.

00:38:34:38 – 00:39:00:27
Christian Leinbach
A lot of times I think, and we started this way, we had very little training support at all for anybody at any level. We are heavily invested in training, leadership training, certain skills training that are necessary in certain departments. And when you invest in your people and you take care of them financially, and you look for the benefits that make a difference in their lives, you end up with loyalty.

00:39:00:27 – 00:39:19:19
Christian Leinbach
And when we do our quarterly employee celebrations five years on up, I’m amazed how many times we are 30, 35, 40, 45. I remember so far one person is 50 years.

00:39:19:19 – 00:39:20:28
David Martin
You’re the kid.

00:39:20:33 – 00:39:20:50
Christian Leinbach
And I’m.

00:39:20:50 – 00:39:21:50
David Martin
The kid. Okay.

00:39:21:52 – 00:39:26:57
Christian Leinbach
Those are two two initiatives that I think are vitally important and make a difference for our county.

00:39:26:59 – 00:39:41:51
David Martin
Well, speaking of loyalty, you are a loyal friend of the good government. Show we would not be here. We’re not for you. Thank you for inspiring us to start the Good Government Show and for being our favorite guest. I think you’re you’ve been on more than anyone else, so thanks for coming, as always.

00:39:41:53 – 00:39:54:19
Christian Leinbach
Well, thank you and thank you for the good government show. And thank you for the sponsors, for W.E.B., and especially all the best to Jim Ludlow in his new book.

00:39:54:24 – 00:39:59:19
David Martin
Yes, indeed, our partnership loved the Royal cousins. Christian, always a pleasure to talk to you again.

00:39:59:19 – 00:39:59:57
Christian Leinbach
Thank you.

00:39:59:57 – 00:40:03:59
David Martin
Thank you.

00:40:04:04 – 00:40:25:34
David Martin
The Good Government Institute has a new partner, the Charles F Kettering Foundation. I really like their podcast to context, and I bet you will too. They have a new series called Democracy Under Construction. The show is hosted by historian Alex Lovett, and he looks back at the first 250 years of U.S. history. Alex digs into the moments that have pushed us towards an inclusive democracy.

00:40:25:36 – 00:40:34:07
David Martin
You can find it where you’re listening right now, or visit Kettering and give them a follow.

00:40:34:12 – 00:40:52:04
David Martin
Want to hear more about good government? Check out another show I host leading Iowa Good Government in Iowa cities. I host the show with Brad Kavanagh, mayor of Dubuque, Iowa and the immediate past president of the Iowa League of Cities. Together, we talked to leaders in Iowa cities. We talk about what works and what good government looks like in Iowa.

00:40:52:06 – 00:40:59:51
David Martin
Join us right here. We’re listening. Now that’s leading Iowa. Good government in Iowa cities.

00:40:59:56 – 00:41:17:00
David Martin
Be as passion as you want to be. Let’s not make it personal. That’s great advice from Berks County Commissioner Christian Linebacker. As you heard, one of the first good government stories we told on this show is about the Berks County program. R3 glad to hear it’s still going strong and they’ve expanded on the program. Good government and action.

00:41:17:02 – 00:41:36:54
David Martin
Transportation is at the top of every government officials list. Christian is working on both planes and trains. Mostly he’s planning for the future and working with neighbor counties to help save money and pull resources. Again, more good government. Here’s some insight into one of the projects Christian said, and I quote. We’re changing the lives of people and their families around them fundamentally.

00:41:36:54 – 00:41:53:12
David Martin
And guess what? It’s saving taxpayer money. That’s his quote. Isn’t that what government is supposed to be about? Another good conversation with Berks County Commissioner and the best friend of this pod, Christian linebacker. Well, that’s our show. Thanks for listening. Please like us and cherish with your friends and review us right here where you’re listening, and check out our website.

00:41:53:12 – 00:42:06:52
David Martin
Good government show for extras. Help us keep telling stories of good government and action everywhere. Join us again for another episode right here. I’m Dave Martin and this is the Good Government show.

00:42:06:57 – 00:42:45:52
David Martin
The Good Government Show is produced by the Good Government Institute, a nonprofit organization promoting civic engagement and civic education. All donations to the show helped promote trust in government. You can donate at Good Govt Institute. That’s good govt institute. Executive producers are Jim Ludlow, Dave Martin, that’s me and David Snyder. Jason Stershic is our editor and producer. Join us again to hear good stories about our government right here on The Good Government Show.

00:42:45:57 – 00:42:49:01
Narrator
This podcast is part of the democracy Group.

**This transcription was created using digital tools and has not been edited by a live person. We apologize for any discrepancies or errors.